Your Joyful Order With Leslie Martinez

#111 Seasons of Friendship: When to Hold On and When to Let Go

• Leslie Martinez • Season 5 • Episode 111

Share episode

Send us a text

The friendships we cultivate shape our lives in profound ways. But what happens when we intentionally place God at the center of these relationships? Cally Logan, author and storyteller, joins us to explore the transformative power of God-centered friendships and how they differ from ordinary connections.

Friendship becomes something sacred when two people surrender the timing, purpose, and direction of their relationship to God's authorship. Cally shares how these divinely orchestrated connections provide mutual accountability that fosters spiritual growth for both parties. We discuss the biblical examples of friendship—from Job's companions who sat with him in his suffering to the covenant bond between Jonathan and David that transcended family loyalty.

Many women find themselves becoming what Cally calls "bellhop friends"—constantly carrying others' emotional baggage while having no one to turn to with their own struggles. We unpack the importance of setting healthy boundaries and recognize that some friendships are meant for seasons while others are lifelong. Cally vulnerably reveals how God once showed her she had "outgrown" a friendship—a painful but necessary realization that allowed both women to follow their unique spiritual paths.

For those who've been deeply wounded by past relationships, Cally offers hope and practical wisdom: "Don't determine your worth on people who didn't know how to love you well." The path to healing involves surrendering our desire for connection to God's perfect timing and selection while developing discernment about who to let into our inner circle.

This conversation goes beyond surface-level friendship advice to explore how we can cultivate relationships that reflect God's design for community. Whether you're longing for deeper connections, navigating difficult transitions, or praying for God-aligned friendships, you'll find encouragement to trust God's authorship of your relationships.

Want to connect more with Cally? Find her books and resources at callylogan.com or follow her on Instagram for daily inspiration that helps you find beauty in life's mysteries.

Connect with Leslie:

Follow on IG: @yourjoyfulorderstyle

Website: https://www.yourjoyfulorder.com/

Email: lmartinez@yourjoyfulorder.com
to schedule- Speaking Events, Interviews or Life Coaching Sessions

Shop my SOAP the Gospels Journal on Shopify:
https://shopjoyfulorder.com/

Watch this Episode on You Tube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsXoAYIM2mfclNtYiaOzIUw

Shop my Journal (Gratitude, Goals & Prayer Journal) on Amazon:
https://a.co/d/09Djvaw

Book a FREE 30 Minute Discovery Coaching Call: https://tidycal.com/joyfulordermedia/30-minute-meeting

Leslie:

Hey friend, welcome back to another episode. Today we're diving into a topic that is both powerful and deeply personal, and that is God-centered friendships. Relationships are one of the greatest gifts that I think God has given us, but when they are rooted in Christ they become something truly transformational, and in this episode we'll explore what makes the Christ-centered friendship different and how we can build and sustain these meaningful connections To help us unpack this. I'm thrilled to introduce today's guest. Her name is Kelly Logan. Kelly is an author of three books, a senior writer for Crosswalkcom and Rooted in Truth, and she's a gifted storyteller who finds beauty in life's mysteries. She believes that each of us holds a unique God-written story and together that we are part of his grand narrative. With a background in teaching and a passion for encouraging others in their faith, kelly brings us incredible wisdom and insight for today's conversation.

Leslie:

So let's get ready to dive in. Hey everyone, I'm Leslie Martinez and you're listening to your Joyful Order podcast. Each week, I will bring you joyful stories that will motivate and inspire you and, at the same time, bring order to your everyday life. Let's just say the show will be a mixture of preaching and teaching, with a kick of motivation from your girl here. Welcome to your Joyful Order podcast.

Leslie:

Kelly, I am so excited to welcome you to the podcast. Thank you, I'm so happy to be here. Yes, now, kelly and I kind of met through social media, right?

Leslie:

Yeah Well, and kind of a mutual friend. Oh, that's right, Trish that's right, so I think it's fitting, I think, with our topic today, and everything else too, which is talking about God-centered friendships.

Leslie:

But, kelly, first I just want you to share I gave a little intro about you and some amazing things You're an author, a teacher and all the great things that you do but I want you to share with the audience just a little bit more about yourself.

Cally:

Oh, thank you, you know. Yeah, I say that I, the Lord, gave me this title, that I'm a storyteller for the story maker and I love sharing the good news. I love sharing the good news about Jesus. I love sharing stories that he's walked me through personally. I love sharing other people's powerful stories that can bring just refreshment to the soul, and I think that's really who I am. I'm also a school teacher by day, writer by night. No-transcript.

Leslie:

I think most teachers can be just amazing storytellers, right?

Leslie:

I think it's just like part of the role that we have played, especially if you've worked with younger ones, like if you've done, you know, elementary level, preschool level, like you have to become an amazing storyteller, right? So I think it's just a hat that many teachers wear and now it's like you look at that preparation that God put in you, like I look at how God prepared me to do what I'm doing now, and so much of it goes back to the classroom, right, you just prepare and stuff now, and so much of it goes back to the classroom, right, you just prepare and stuff, but anyhow. So I want us to dive in into this conversation of God-centered friendships, kelly, and when you and I kind of chatted, there were so many topics I could have shared with you, but there was just like a nudge in my heart where I'm like I think Kelly and I need to have this conversation about what sets God-centered friendships apart from regular friendships. So let's just dive into that a little bit. What do you think a God-centered friendship really looks like?

Speaker 3:

I love this question because I love looking at it from the perspective of God-authored and God-prov. God provided friendships too, and I think probably the biggest differentiation is when you are entering into it's any kind of friendship. You know, there's kind of a difference between having well, this friendship is just here and we're friends but we're not really accountable to anyone or anything. This friendship's just existing.

Speaker 3:

But when you have a friendship that is God authored, that that it is God-ordained, that it's God-brought, you have that opportunity to come into a friendship that is you're accountable to the Lord and you both are, and I think that can provide so much ample growth for both parties because they're both connecting with the Lord and that friendship and they're allowing him in surrender. You know, when they give God their yes to say Lord, we want you to be the center, the core, the author of the timing of this friendship, of the fragrance of this friendship, of all the pieces of this friendship. And I was just struck by Proverbs 27, 9, which is from the Passion Translation. It says sweet friendships refresh the soul and awaken our hearts with joy, for good friends are like the anointing oil that yields the fragrant incense of God's presence.

Leslie:

That's so good, kelly, so good, and one of the I think an important thing that you brought up is the accountability part. Right, god aligns certain friendships, relationships, and there is an accountability part that goes with that. And I don't think that's something that most people think of when maybe getting into a new friendship, and I mean we can say relationships, but I think that's something that most people think of when maybe getting into a new friendship, and I mean we can say relationships. But I think we're specifically talking about like friendships right now.

Leslie:

And I really want to talk specifically about women friendships. Right, because you can have a friendship with a male, right, I mean a female male. I have lots of male friends also, you know, and then I have like my relationship, my, my husband, my spouse, relationship with my mother, my sister, all of that we're talking about like friends. Okay, friends that are not related to you, um, friends, women friendships, because women friendships are, I think, hard to keep, hard sustain, especially when women, we have so many hats that we wear Wife, mom, daughter, sister, like there's so many different aspects and responsibilities that we play. So, the accountability of having a God-aligned friendship, I think it also comes with a spiritual maturity, wouldn't you say?

Speaker 3:

Kelly, oh for sure, and I think it's allowing him to set the pace and the authorship.

Speaker 3:

I was thinking this morning in preparation for this.

Speaker 3:

One of the things that came up in my prayer time was a friendship that I have, that I value this gal so highly and I still count her deeply as a wonderful friend.

Speaker 3:

But the Lord actually led us both to have a time where we're not interacting in friendship right now in community, and it was such a strange occurrence. But it brought us both, I could tell, in maturity and so we'll check in every you know few months or so and just say, hey, I just want you to know I love you, I'm rooting for you and I want nothing but the best for you, and kind of just do a tip for tap. But I was thinking about that and how that does come with a maturity. That comes with a posture of saying, lord, as much as I want to go grab coffee with her this week, you have an assignment on her life and you have an assignment on mine. That right now, having that interaction is not what you're authoring. Having that maturity to say, lord, we want what you want and mutually say that, saying Lord, we value our relationship with you more than we value our relationship with one another.

Leslie:

Yeah, that's so good, and understanding the discernment that comes with that, though, also and that's where this spiritual maturity comes in when we look at just relationships and whole friendships, christ-centered relationships truly reflects God's design for community for us also, and the importance of that. God didn't call us to be lonely. God didn't call us to do things by ourselves, right, we look back at the Bible and you see community and friendships everywhere. I was sharing with you before we hit record here that I was kind of looking at what were some good stories to share from the Bible about some friendships that God ordained friendships, and there's so many different friendships that we can learn from from the Bible. I just read Job in like January and February I was sitting with Job in Job for a minute, and Job had several friends that sat with him quietly for just seven days, like they were just being compassionate, they were lamenting with him as he lost everything, he was suffering, and they said nothing, but just their presence was there with him, right?

Leslie:

So you have a friend that is suffering, that is going through something. Sometimes you don't even have to like say anything, it's just sitting there with them and those friends, after that quiet time, like came out and they're like Job, you sinned, you deserved it. Like they started just like slashing him and ripping him apart right and later, like we kind of see, like first we thought, oh, these were some amazing friends, right, they were so compassionate, they were so patient with him, they were just lamenting and filling his pain with him. And then that turned into like oh, whoa, whoa, wait a minute, these, these are the kind of friends that we thought they were Right. And I mean the story kind of like comes, like you know, full circle and you know, job forgave these friends and God blessed them too.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, yeah, he did Right. Or to bless them, which I think is beautiful, because I think, although they came at him in a lot of judgment, he didn't forget that they were still people who were willing to sit with him in his lament.

Leslie:

Right, I want to touch upon that, kelly, like how important is it for you to have that community and those type of friends that will will sit with you through the suffering and even call you out.

Speaker 3:

Exactly Well, and I think it's important. It's where we have to be in a way choosing, in the way of not us choosing but letting the Lord choose our friends for us. And that requires surrender and saying Lord, if you're going to be Lord, if you're going to be, you know, the full authority and complete covering of my life, then that means all of my life, not just some. That means my friendships, my finances, my career, et cetera. And so I think, when we hand over friendships, because we don't think to do it right off, do we we think, oh well, no, that's just, you know, susie, like, of course, she's always been here, she'll always be there. Why would God have a problem with that person? Right, and I don't think it's necessary that God has a problem with that person, but he may not be authoring that she be right next to you, in the loudest voice in your ear.

Speaker 3:

I think important questions to ask with friendship are do they challenge me to grow closer to the Lord or to rely more on my own strengths? Do they ask the good questions of providing opportunity, something I try to do when a friend things are, you know, going awry and it's chaotic saying do you need to vent. Do you need someone to listen? Do you want solutions? Do you want to do something distracting, or do you want to do all three? And it's providing that opportunity for them to communicate and say, no, I just need someone to listen, or no. What do you think I should do, you know? Or just distract me, or having that lament like Job's friends did initially. And I think when we pray for godly friendships, that you know not everyone's going to be perfect, so if they don't hit all three, don't be like, oh, you're out, you know, but look at it, lord, what are you offering for this season and how can these friendships be stewarded so that, ultimately, we are blessing you more than anything else?

Leslie:

That's so good. You know those questions that you said when you ask somebody like, do you just need me to listen, do you need to vent? I think that goes with all relationships. That is a piece of advice that just goes across the board Friendships, marriage with you know, a parent, a sister, anything that's just I think great to ask in a whole sister, anything that's just I think great to ask in a whole. Now, in that, like communication, I think is a huge part of having healthy, god-centered relationships, right, or friendships, so to say, how can you cultivate that type of communication with friends Like you? You just said how you will ask that right, and we don't, we don't automatically have those types of how can you say like connection with people right away, where I think some people are comfortable to to come out and just say that right. So how, in being intentional of creating God-centered friendships, how can you cultivate that type of relationship or friendship with somebody from the beginning? A great question.

Speaker 3:

I think a lot of it is getting to know the language of the friend, and I say that in a way, not just English, spanish, french, whatever. I mean. How do they communicate? And I think a lot of that comes from observing, watching, not in a creepy way, you know, but seeing if they're communicating on something. Maybe they really connect well with movies, maybe they really connect well with movies and that's something that they are able to comprehend and absorb and describe.

Speaker 3:

Things say, I feel like this character and this character is representing what I feel in that moment and I think part of that is learning the language of your friend and asking the Lord I don't know how this person communicates best Could you help me so that I can come alongside and one be a conduit of you, provide whatever message you want to give them through me, if you want to use me as voice box or to help them in a way that it's actually helpful, because I think sometimes we, especially as women, we all have different approaches and it's because we all came up, you know, being raised in different households, different communication styles, and so we don't readily think, oh, that person might have an entirely different communication style than I do.

Speaker 3:

And so if you really want to grow in doing life with that friend and I think ultimately you know when it's a godly friendship, it's going past friendship and it's going into sisterhood, because you're doing life with that person and you're almost like a covenant, like Jonathan and David had where you're saying this is something that I'm making, the choice to do life with you through thick and through thin and I want to learn your heart and how you communicate and how you navigate things so that I can actually be an asset to you and I'm not just heaping on more for you to overthink.

Leslie:

Mm-hmm. Ah, so good, kelly. Now one of the things you brought up Jonathan and David, which that was one of the people from the Bible that I had read that has like a great friendship. Right, and looking at Jonathan, jonathan was Saul's son and Saul was trying to kill David and overthrow him, right? So there was this like rivalry between Saul and David, and Jonathan, the son, like is here and he's kind of like the middleman between them. It's like, okay, I have my father and my best friend here, how? How do I choose? Ultimately?

Leslie:

And it was truly the discernment of God that allowed Jonathan to make the choice to protect David, even going against his own father. But it was that discernment because he was aligning himself and preparing his heart. Like God, what is it that you want me to do here? Am I to listen to my father and try to kill David? Do I protect him? And the intention was for Jonathan to protect him because David had a big calling on his life, what God placed on him. And the intention was for Jonathan to protect him because David had a big calling on his life, what God placed on him. And what you were saying is just so important to know that we need to be praying for our friends. Ultimately, we need to have that discernment and knowing God. What is this friendship intended for? How can you know, how can I pray for my friend? How can I be there for my friend? But what is my calling in this friendship also, which I think is so important? Now, how can you?

Leslie:

This is, I think, a big question, especially for women that I guess are like transitioning. We all go through different seasons, we have different friends in different seasons, but sometimes, like we have childhood friends, right, friends that you've been friends with forever, you've went to school with, grade school with, you have, you know, you've done high school, you've graduated together, maybe friends that you met in college, friends that you've worked with other, friends that you've met at church or through other you know community, whatever organizations or stuff that you're a part of. I mean you can find friends lots of different areas. Recently, covid hit. All of us were forced to be at home and a lot of these social areas of where we typically would find friendships, we didn't have them and I was in a season where I was looking for those God aligned women in my life. Right, and this was shortly out of COVID. I had.

Leslie:

We went, you know, a couple of years of not having anything. I had transitioned to a new church, so a lot of people that I had good friendships with because of me leaving the church and then COVID hitting, it was like three years of me not having God aligned friendships. So I was starting to feel lonely. I was like sad I didn't have friendships of like women, like hey, let's go have breakfast together, let's go grab tea or go grab dessert, let's go have a dinner together. I was missing that and I was craving that.

Leslie:

So I was intentional about going and getting into community groups that were for women and, I kid you not, I prayed, kelly. I was praying like I need God aligned friendships in my life. I miss them. You know. I had them left my church. Covid hit. I've been three years without them. I need them back in my life. So, as I prayed about it, there was a community group that came up in my church and it was called Find your People and it was based on a book by Jeannie Allen and it was all about finding your people, like finding those women, finding those God aligned friendships. So I did it through a community group but I want you to share, maybe if there are any other ways that either you or that you know other people that you've maybe heard of that has found friendships like being intentional, like how can people be intentional about forming and fostering those God-centered friendships?

Speaker 3:

I love your story with that and my favorite part is that you invited the Lord to lead and you said Lord, I want these friendships from you. I don't want to go just seeking you know, forging my own path. I want you to lead me to this friend, but this friend to me as well, because I might have something to steward and a portion to give them to bless their life as well, and I think that's so beautiful. I think there are so many different ways and I think it's letting God be creative how those friendships blossom. Some of the best friendships I've ever had came from a job that I took after college. I started working for Apple and I found that there were other Christians there and we started chatting and things and those friendships grew.

Speaker 3:

And I'm such an introvert myself, so making friends is not my superpower and that's okay. But I love seeing how creative the Lord can be and introducing people and being open to coming to, you know, a birthday party of a friend that maybe you're a little reluctant, You're like I only know this friend, I don't know anyone else at the party but being open to saying, OK, let me go, Let me give this a shot. No-transcript people you know, and just everyone comes together and circle and it's amazing how those friendships can be cultivated. So I think it's not limiting God for his creativity and just saying that brave yes that's so, so true.

Leslie:

I, I think, one of the ways on going. So, going back to this community group, right, I prayed, and then I see this group come, and then I didn't even mention this. So, kelly, not only was like it the perfect topic, right, find your people. I'm like this is what I was praying for, god, this is exactly. I need to find my people. Well, it also so happened to be.

Leslie:

This was a community group based out of my church. My church is um in the city of Brea, which is about like 25 minutes from me. Well, the community group was being hosted in my own city, at, at a, at a home here, um nearby in Coina, and the house where it was at was like six minutes away from me. Wow, this couldn't be more aligned, right? So then, in this community group, I met some of the most amazing women that, over the two years, have become very good friends of mine, where we now do a lot of community groups together.

Leslie:

We go back and forth over whose homes they're in, who leads, and we just we come together every week so that we can share and learn and be vulnerable with each other. You know, we've sat with each other, we've cried in each other's homes. We pray for each other. Just this morning one of the girls said we had like a chat and she was texting asking us to pray for her today for something going on at work. And I'm just like God, like I go back to think three years ago how I prayed for this and now I'm sitting in answered prayers, where I'm like these are the God aligned friendships that I was craving, that I was looking for, and God knew the people that he needed to align me with, because these are women that not only love God, that are transparent with me. We're transparent with each other, but we not only call each other out, we call each other up.

Leslie:

But we not only call each other out, we call each other up and it has been such a blessing to see, like you know, even just chat, like conversations via text right, praying for each other, supporting each other that way, joking with each other, but sitting in each other's homes and supporting each other to grow, challenging each other to grow, challenging each other to challenging each other to grow, challenging each other to think and look at things differently and to be with women that are aligned with your and I don't want to say your thinking, it's not your thinking, but aligned with your faith. It makes such a huge difference. I just want to like ask you how can we encourage and challenge one another spiritually in these types of friendships.

Speaker 3:

I think a lot of that comes from, you know, being sensitive to the leaving of the Holy Spirit.

Speaker 3:

You know, if you are to give, the rebuke is such a hard word, right, you know, like I said, so fierce.

Speaker 3:

But I think you can come along from a side end and you can encourage the friend in doing right by the Lord and I think, looking for friendships like that and coming in with that kind of side angle, but I think also cultivating a spirit where you are looking at those friendships and saying, lord, what are you growing in me? What are you growing in this person that you want to completely define, you want to redefine that, you want to do through this and that want to do through this and end that? And I think it's having a bar set that you know, if I'm in a friendship that is not valuing my worth, or this person is not encouraging me in walking upright, then maybe I need to rethink some of our interactions or the frequency of interaction and things like that, because I love that you guys have that community group where you are sharing together and it's not just one-on-one, that it is finding your people. You have that center table and that's beautiful.

Leslie:

And I was actually going to get into the next question to ask you, kelly, is like, how do we handle friendships that may not be spiritually aligned? And you were kind of touching upon that a little bit. But we and this kind of aligns with another question that I wanted to ask and we can kind of intertwine these questions here, because we too know that friendships go through a season, right, and that's kind of sometimes hard to navigate. Also, like it's difficult to keep certain friendships, especially when we get elevated and called up with God. And there are friendships that maybe don't align with you spiritually because they necessarily aren't walking the same walk that you are, and I know that that's been a challenge for me.

Leslie:

I have friends that I love and adore, that I've been friends with like forever, that I even, you know, consider family, and we go through different seasons, you know. But we can pick up like if nothing has ever, like I can go maybe a year or so without having talked to that friend, but because we have such a deep rooted background, we can go a year not talking and when we connect it's like we we don't skip a beat, you know, because we just know where each other are at. So there's friends that are free. And let me go back. You have those friends that I guess you can say they're like your lifers, you know what I mean Like where they've become family and you're more like. It's like your sister, your family friends, right, and no matter what season you go through, they're always going to be there.

Leslie:

Okay, I have those friends. I literally have like three that I can say these are my like forever friends, you know. And then you have your friends that are just here for seasons. And how, how do you work with those friends that are here for a season and then dealing with the friends that are not spiritually aligned? So let's kind of have both of those conversations there.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, putting those merging of together.

Speaker 3:

I think, a lot of similarities in the Venn diagram of that Right. Right, because it's very painful in many ways, especially if you have more of a sensitive heart or you have a heart that I've been walking with them, I've been doing this, that and the other Like what do you mean? I have to let this friendship grow. Or I had a friendship very vulnerably sharing. I had a friendship that I think the world of this person loved her dearly and there were just some kind of red flag moments and when I brought it to the Lord he said you've outgrown her. And when I brought it to the Lord he said you've outgrown her. My heart sank in a lot of ways because that was not the answer that I wanted, but I couldn't say you're wrong, lord, because I realized, yeah, and I realized that that was one of the biggest things of seasonal friendships.

Speaker 3:

And thinking about like a little tree, you know if you plant the tree in a planter and it'll grow, but it can't grow past the pot that it's in. And if it's outgrown that pot, as much as it has clung to the pot, it's been in the pot for a while, it's never going to grow further unless you allow it to. You plant it in that bigger field and I think it's also looking hey, this is not just a about me thing and saying, hey, this might, I might be holding this person back from a friendship during their action. They need to meet something further, that they need to go Maybe a group of friends that are in a familiar, you know, a similar field of work or study or ministry and I don't want to hold them back from that either, and so it is very painful of letting that go. But I think it's also knowing you can still pray for that person, you can still love that person, you can still root for that person, even if that person isn't somebody that you're talking to on a daily basis person, even if that person isn't somebody that you're talking to on a daily basis.

Speaker 3:

Yeah and yeah, being willing to let that go and I, so I did that for seasonal and then I think, for the ones where it's it's not spiritually aligned, it's similar. It's saying, lord, I, I can try. You know you've done the work, you, you've come alongside, you've said, hey, this, that and the other, and you're you're trying to encourage them in the lord. Sometimes what it takes is having disengaging and no longer communing with that person, because they may not realize that they need the Lord, and if you're longer standing there, them being alone, it can be a little bit louder for God to, for them to just have the one-on-one. And so it's loving that friend enough, saying Lord, if you are asking me, I will obey and I will disengage from this friendship and continuing to pray for their alignment with the Lord, continuing to pray for them, continuing to love them in the same way with the seasonal friendships, but handing them over to the Lord to do the work and refinement that he wants to do with them, and not giving up on prayer for them too.

Leslie:

Yes, prayer is so powerful for your friendships, for sure, that's so good. Kelly, you touched on so many things because I, like I, I reflect you. You hit a kind of. I kind of had like an aha moment because when you said that the God, god, told you that you have outgrown that friend, um, that kind of was like ouch, there are certain. No, they're. Like. It was almost like that God is speaking through you to me, because I never imagined outgrowing friends, right? And.

Leslie:

I guess I didn't look at it in that way of outgrowing and, like you said, it could be that you have outgrown them, it could be that they have outgrown you even. It can go both ways. But you're no longer spiritually aligned because someone has outgrown some way or another. Either someone has outgrown because they're going up or someone has outgrown because they've fallen back, kind of thing.

Speaker 3:

Or they're going in an entirely different direction. Exactly, exactly. It's just they are called down a path that you're not called down and it's outgrown in that we were in a similar season, we had similar things that we were doing, and now I'm going to this way and you're going this way.

Leslie:

And they're both in alignment with the Lord or they're both right for us, and but that's no longer the same season together. And, as you had said that, like I, many friendships came to mind where I'm like, is it an outgrowing thing, god, or is it just not in alignment? And going back to when I was praying for like these God aligned friendships, right, one of the things that I had prayed for, because I had realized that I had become the friend that everybody comes to Leslie, I need prayer, leslie, I need prayer. Leslie, I need advice, leslie, how can I get out of this? Like I became the dumping ground for friends, right, and I didn't have a dumping ground. I didn't have a friend that I could go to to vent, to ask for prayer, to trust with the struggles that I was going with. Because I realized, like I looked at my circle and I'm like these friendships are not aligned with God, because they're not in that place with God where I feel that I will get wisdom from them rather than judgment or negativity or just a like okay, you know, kind of thing.

Leslie:

Like I knew that I had friends that I could vent to right, we all have those like venting friends, but I didn't have a circle of friends that I could go to and say, hey, I need your advice on this. I need you to pray for me, like I need you to go to war for me in prayer. I didn't have that. Those people were like my mom and my sister and my husband which don't get me wrong, I mean, those are great people to have that but I needed friends.

Leslie:

Because guess what Some of those prayers were? Like I need you to pray that I, like don't punch my kid in their face. Like I need you to pray that I don't go off on my husband. Like we need those friendships so that, like I can't vent to my mom about my mom, I can't vent to my sister about my sister, I can't vent to my husband about my husband, right? So you need those friendships. So someone that is not part of your family, because some of the things that you need advice on, you need prayer about, are in regards to that circle of your family.

Speaker 3:

And you can't be the only one giving too and you need prayer about are in regards to that circle of your family, and you can't be the only one giving too. I call it being a bellhop friend, where they want you to carry all their baggage. And it's so hard to be the bellhop friend because you're like I love you but I can't carry your baggage and mine, I can't, yeah.

Leslie:

Like Kelly, there was a season where I literally was being dumped on by so many people. And I was just like God.

Leslie:

Ok, I know you called me to be like a prayer warrior and be praying with these women. You called me to serve other women and these were friends during this time. Right, these weren't just like acquaintances or stuff. These were people that I had a't just like acquaintances or stuff. These were people that I had a friendship with at one point or another, that just at the same time they all were going through and this was like deep stuff, Kelly, deep heavy stuff divorce affairs, like you know, custody issues like death, disease, like it was. It was heavy, right, and this, this was just coming out of COVID also. So there was just so much heaviness already coming out of COVID and I like I questioned that's where I was still sitting, like still trying to find these friendships and just like god, what? Okay, god, what am I? What am I supposed to learn from here? I don't know why, like I'm getting dumped on on all of this. But then I also realized that I had not created any type of boundaries in these friendships. I had the floodgates opened where I made myself readily available at any given moment. Call me if you need me to pray, if you need a vent, like, just call me at any time, reach out to me, and they did and I would respond because I just felt like I had to. I was, you know, being obedient, like these are people I need to pray for.

Leslie:

But then my heart started getting heavy. My heart started getting hate and anger for some of the things that these people were going through, you know. And and then I started to realize, okay, now, who can I go to to dump this on that I can ask to pray for me and stuff like that. And I had nobody, Kelly, I mean other than like my husband and stuff like that, you know. But I realized, like a lot of my friends, that I during that season, that I was friends with where I was at, with God and where I needed to go, I didn't see. I didn't see that spiritual alignment to where I can say, I think if I go to this friend, they're going to give me the wisdom and the godly words that I need right now.

Leslie:

I didn't have that and, being the person that got dumped on all the time, I realized I have to create boundaries. I cannot be the dumping person. And also, if I'm giving advice and praying for you, like, stop coming and asking for the same advice that I told you three, four times already, you know. So then that's where, like you were saying, you just need to pray for those friends and walk away.

Leslie:

So it got to where I'm like God. I've given them the words that you have spoken to me and in and through me to share with them. I'm done with them. I cannot continue to let you sit at my table and dump on me and be the negative person that you are if you're not going to get yourself right with God. So it became a kind of like releasing and a weight off my shoulder. Then, where I'm like God, I'm just giving them to you. Here's my friend, and I still continue to pray for those people and every now and then, if they come into God, puts them in my heart, send them a quick text hey, I'm just thinking and praying for you. Here's a scripture, whatever it is, and I know that if those are friendships that are met for the long haul, that God will bring us back when they are in a much better place where now we are God aligned, and I think that's where it's important to look back at the seasons that we go through, right.

Speaker 3:

Entirely and I think too. I think what you'll find is, once in a while, you will find a friend when you set that boundary. They may contact you later and say I had a friend where I set a boundary and he had walked away from the faith. It was being very derogatory about Christians and it was very offensive to me, very offensive to me, and it got to the point where I set a boundary where I just unfriended him on everything and decided not to continue to participate because it was just making me upset and it was making me really, you know, just agitated and heartbroken over somebody who had them walking in faith and then walked away. And it was about a year later I got out of the blue text and he said you have been the only person who ever set a boundary with me and I just wanted to say thank you and how much I respect that and I have been really wrong and I am starting again to find faith, to find God. I'm starting this new journey and I'd like to ask your forgiveness, blown away by that text, but recognizing that it was the right thing for me to do, instead of clinging so hard to try to save him to, instead let him go, give him to God, pray for him on the sidelines, but set that boundary and then let God do his thing.

Speaker 3:

And I think it took some of that. Whoa wait, she's not on my friend list anymore. What happened here? And everything else too, and I don't think it was just a me thing, but I think there were other circumstances. But I think it was a pivotal piece that the Lord used. And so I think, in the same way of you sharing your story, I cannot help but wonder if the Lord, you know your prayers for these friends they're going to find later. Hey, this was the right thing and that was actually loving me the best way they possibly could.

Leslie:

And loving me most was loving me so much that they God pleased they didn't people please and they set that boundary, yeah, and I I think that one of the more challenging things in friendships and this is, you know, as we older, it's really hard to have mature friendships, even God-aligned friendships, and we look at, we have, like you can say, oh, I have so many friends Like Kelly. You and me we just became friends, right, we became friends through social media acquaintances. We're sitting here having this conversation but then, like you have your circle of people that you just like trust with everything, right, you tell them your deepest, darkest prayers, challenges, struggles, everything. You're just real with those people and those are the ones that you want to make sure God align, because you want to trust them and know that if I am struggling, if I am going through something, that these are going to be the women that are going to call me up and call me out, that are going to fight for me in prayer, that are going to like, literally get on their knees for me if anything that I need, you know, if I'm ill, if I, you know, something happens tragically in my life or with my family, those are the women that I just know they're going to go to battle for me. And I have a lot of family, my, I come from a background of like prayer warriors my aunts, cousins, all of that. I know that in any given time if I need someone to battle for me in prayer, I'm going to go to my family, right, and those were the people that I was going to all the time. I'm so blessed and fortunate to have that. Not everybody has that in their family that you can say, hey, I have like eight girl cousins that are my prayer warriors my sister, my auntie, all of that right, all family. I wanted friends. I want to say that I have these friends that I can go to also for this, and I so thankfully, can say that I have that now.

Leslie:

But it took work and it took me being vulnerable and putting myself out there. It took for me praying. I literally got on my knees and wrote in my prayer journal Lord, send me God aligned friends, send me people that I can trust, that will battle for me, that will get on their knees and pray for me when I am going through stuff. You know, and I remember doing that like two, three years ago. And then here I am now with these women in my house of us praying together, right, and it's just like a full circle moment where I'm just like, wow, god.

Leslie:

And then I look at the seasons, though, too. I want to just kind of touch a little bit more on this, because we, as women, go through so many seasons in our life, right? Like, I think back to when my boys were little and I would have play dates with other moms and they became good friends during that time, right, our kids, like I have two friends that our kids when they were little, they played together all the time. They went from pre-K all the way to like seventh grade together, and when they the kids got older, of course, like our kids started to go their own way. Therefore, we started to go our own way. We didn't see each other all the time because we weren't at the birthday parties anymore, we weren't at the school functions anymore, we weren't hanging out after school or spring break, or you know stuff like that.

Leslie:

Because our, our kids too, their friendships, you know, they got into high school. They all three went to, or two of them went to, different high schools, right? So there were three friends that I'm talking about with my son. There was three of them, and one went to one high school. The other two went to the other high school. Those two, they remained best friends all through high school. The other friend, like you know, she of it came a little distant and um, but me and that mom, we still to this day talk. Right, we still talk to each other, we still go and hang out.

Leslie:

And then my son, he went off to college, him and his friend. That stuck together. They both went to very two separate colleges and now they two they don't talk as much anymore, right, because they both are living very different lives, but if they come back together it's like they picked up like nothing. Right, and I think about that, like with my friends too, is that we go down so many different roads. Where God takes us. God is calling us to make new friendships, to impact new people, to create lives and seasons.

Leslie:

You know, like my son, he's at college right now and he has some great friends. We were just down there a couple weekends ago and we got to. My husband and I got to sit and talk with his roommate and another good friend of ours that we hear all these stories about, right, and we got to sit there for like a few hours with them and my husband and I walked away and, like I said, you know, I'm so glad that he has good friends. Like these seem like really great kids. You know, I shouldn't even say kids because they're adults, technically young men, right. Like these are young men that I'm like I was sitting there for like an hour talking with one of them, like I probably was like sharing way TMI with this one kid, but we we were talking it up about a really random talk.

Leslie:

We had a really random conversation but I was so proud of my son for cultivating and bringing good kids into his life, and that's something that I pray for also, kelly, yeah, and for the mamas out there, it is so important for you to pray for those people.

Leslie:

For your kid I prayed for since day one when my kids started going to school, like I had a prayer that Lord, surround my boys with Christ mindedminded people, with Christ-minded friends that are going to love Jesus, that are going to create joy in their lives, and just all this stuff.

Leslie:

And then, even as my boys have gotten into high school, I started praying for the future women that are going to be in their lives. My son has an amazing girlfriend right now and I prayed for her Like she is an answered prayer right now, right. So it's so important for you to pray for those friendships, for you to pray for relationships and, like for those mamas out there, pray that God surrounds your kids by those people, because I'm seeing now the friendships that my kids have, I'm seeing who the people are surrounding my kids and I think to myself I'm so thankful that I prayed and prayed and prayed for those people, because not only are my kids good friends, but they have good friends that have their back, that have fun with them and that are just good, genuine people, you know. So it's so important in praying right, kelly, I'm sure you can speak to that a little bit.

Speaker 3:

Oh, my goodness, yes, I mean so much, yes, and I think there's the power of prayer and it's it's, it's truly letting God be the Lord of your life, it's letting Jesus be the Lord of your life, it's, it's you have all dominion over my life and and you're seeing that too, where you're connecting with him and you're saying I want these godly friendships not just for me. I want these godly friendships for those I love deeply, that, to those that I've been entrusted with by you, lord, with your, with your kids, your husband, and then you get to live in those answered prayers. And that is just so beautiful and there's so much power in that. That encourages me to stand even firmer and praying for the godly friendships that he has for me.

Leslie:

I love it. Yes, so good. Now, kelly, as we begin to wrap up, I just want you to just kind of share in this last question here of what wisdom can you share with someone that is like struggling right now with loneliness, with longing for deeper connections, someone that is out there that maybe they don't feel worthy of friendships, maybe they've burned some bridges before with other people, but what wisdom and encouragement can you give for that woman right now?

Speaker 3:

I love that. I would say don't determine your worth on people who didn't know how to love you well and who are broken people navigating, and ask the Lord to help. You have really good discernment on the people he wants to bring around, because the enemy will try and he will try and bring those. Hey, these people, they seem nice, right, they seem this, that and the other, and so that's why we need discernment, saying Lord, are these the friends that you have for me? Is this group that you have for me? Because if it's not, I don't want it. If it doesn't have your name on it, lord, I don't want it.

Speaker 3:

And I think you know not settling just because somebody seems nice or because you seem necessary to them. You know we like to help. It makes us feel good to help, but that doesn't mean that we have to be the bellhop friend. It doesn't mean that you are at a status where you are only to serve and not to also be fed as well. So I would encourage that person don't give up on God. He is faithful, he will bring good friends at the right time.

Speaker 3:

But pray for good discernment. Pray for opportunity to make friends at the right time, but pray for good discernment, pray for opportunity to make friends and ultimately make the strongest, best friendship you have in your life, that that you have with your savior. I love the hymn oh, what a Friend we have in Jesus, and I will find myself just singing that from time to time because I really mean it. He really is. He is that best friend that will correct you when you need the correcting, that is kind to listen, has the best advice, and that friendship that is not just a season, that it is forever. And what a joy that is. And I think the closer we get to Christ, the easier it is to see the people who love him too and to know, hey, that person's a Jesus lover. I'm going to go, we should be friends, kind of thing.

Leslie:

The discernment that God gives you when you get closer to him, to surround yourself with those like-minded people. It's like a radar, it's like your little Jesus radar that he gives you when you start to share, like you were sharing earlier, how you started to share with some of your coworkers, and you realize that, hey, I work with some people that are believers and love Jesus like I do. And I just wanted to add, I just really feel like the Spirit is just really reminding me to share this. There's somebody out there that is listening to this that you've been hurt like hurt really bad by a friend. You've someone turned their back on you, they've betrayed you and they just really, really hurt you. And I want you to know that you do not need to give up on finding those God-aligned friendships, because they're out there and God wants you to trust again. You just have to trust in him and just remember that hurt people hurt people. Whoever hurt you, they were hurting themselves and, rather than becoming enemies with them, pray for them and just allow yourself to heal and to forgive and just say you know God, I want to be able to pray for this person and I want to be able to heal so that I can allow myself to have the God aligned friendships that you deserve.

Leslie:

So I just felt a nudge on the Holy Spirit because someone that is listening is going through that right now, and I don't want you to give up on putting yourself out there to make friends. Allow yourself to be vulnerable. Also, put yourself in those places and spaces that will align you with the God-centered people that you deserve to. Well, kelly, I have a couple of fun wrap-up questions for you before we officially end here, but first just thank you for your wisdom, like on this topic I shared with you before. This was kind of a topic that I really didn't know how to go about talking about this, but I felt a nudge in my heart that there's so many women out there that struggle with making God-aligned friendships and I'm so glad that God brought you my way to have this conversation with.

Speaker 3:

So thank you, that's so mutually felt, so very mutually felt, thank you.

Leslie:

Okay, I want to go to just Kelly fun get to know you a little bit. You have written three books. I want you to actually share the three books that you've written, Because we're going to drop a link in the show notes with all of your books there. But tell us about your books and then I want you to actually recommend a book to the listeners that impacted you.

Speaker 3:

I would love to and I actually in my books I actually talk a lot about godly friendship because that is something, man as women, we need it, we try and figure it out and I think it's such an important topic. So I'm so glad you brought it to the table today and I felt really blessed to share this time with you. But I am the author of three books. My first book was Hang In there Girl. It's kind of a book for late teens, early 20-somethings. Makes a really good kind of like coming of age book and it's just a big sister book. It's a big sister in Christ and a book. And the book that came after that was Dear Future Husband and it's a book of encouraging women to pray, to pray for their future spouse, to connect with the Lord, to not just fantasize some book character oh, that's my husband, no, to really pray for this living, breathing man who's walking on the planet and if you know his name or not, god knows his name but ultimately realizing that as the church for the bride of Christ and that relationship with God is the most important and the top relationship of all. And the last book is so different than the other two but it follows in the heart and the mind of cultivating relationship with God, and it's called the Wallflower that Blooms. And it's a book about being authentically you, the you God made you to be, not who your friends say you should be, not who society says you should be, not who society says you should be, um, not who you know anyone else says you should be, but who god ordained you to be, and embracing that and tactical and practical ways to connect with him more and to stand courageously in that authenticity. So, uh, those are my three books. I they've been a labor of love and it's been a joy to see how they've spoken to people and how people have connected with them, and I'm just grateful to get to be the vessel. It's God's work there. But those are my three books. I also write for the Root of Truth and for Crosswalkcom. I write articles for both and for my book that I would share.

Speaker 3:

When you asked that question, the first one that came to my heart was Wild at Heart by John Eldredge. I know it's a book that is more geared towards men and I liked Captivated, which was written by he and his wife, but something about Wild Heart was just for mankind and it was something powerful and pivotal that every time I pick up that book it could be the, you know, the first time I did to the 15th time picking it up. There's something new in there of fruit and realizing how God designed and wired the human being to be, and and just ultimately realizing the thing we need the most is God, you know, and and that was true in the Garden of Eden, and that's true here, and it's true and it will forever be true, and it will forever be true, and so that book really impacted me deeply in some wonderful ways.

Leslie:

Oh, so great the listeners like Kelly just gave us four books, three of hers and one other recommendation. I love leaving our listeners with book recommendations. Recommendation um, I love leaving our listeners with book recommendations. It grows my shelf and then I'm sure it grows the shelf for the listeners also. I do audiobooks too. Are any of your books on audio, kelly? They are uh, oh, okay, okay on audible, so I'm gonna have to. I I'm a big audible because that that has just been the most successful way for me to get through books recently.

Speaker 3:

It's neat and it's so neat to hear it's weird, you know and it was really cool to process, to getting to interview the people who wanted to do the voices too. That was like the coolest thing, and so really thoughtfully choosing, along with the publisher, a voice that I really felt would be a good voice for the book. So, yes, that's awesome.

Leslie:

Okay, so it's not your voice. You've you got to pick out, okay, like a voice actor? Yeah, okay, so so good, though I mean they, they bring life to the book you know um yeah, I love listening. I mean, I've listened to so many audiobooks. Some are read by the author, others are like the voice actors, and I will tell you, the voice has such significance to the audiobooks. It does yeah.

Leslie:

I've started books where I'm like, oh, if I have to listen to this person one more hour, I'm just going to scream. I've regretted those purchases of those audiobooks. Oh no, they did not choose the right voice actor, oh no. And then my last question for you is I want you to share with the audience what is something that brings Kelly joy.

Speaker 3:

Oh, that is a beautiful question. I think something that really brings me joy is just and I mean this is not a Sunday school answer, but it is just so true. It's just knowing the truth that God is always present, that whether it's sunny and 75 outside, or whether it's the worst day of my life, God is present, and that brings me joy. And the Hebrew word for joy is chara. And it's knowing deeply that God is who he says he is and that he is faithful no matter the circumstance. And so I love sitting in that joy of just knowing that he's present.

Leslie:

I love it. I love it. I am writing down that reminder right now of Tara.

Speaker 3:

I'm a big Hebrew and Greek Aramaic nerd. I love studying original language. I write Bible studies and it just yeah, I'm in that phase, kelly. That's why I'm starting to like oh, it's so much fun.

Leslie:

Yes. I'm in that phase. That's why, when you said that, I'm like I don't think I knew the Hebrew word for joy and I'm all about joy, my whole brand.

Speaker 3:

Lovable, but that's my favorite. Yes, yeah, okay, so yes.

Leslie:

Yeah, okay, so, and that's the Hebrew word. I should know the Hebrew word for joy. You know, I actually had looked up that there was a it was like a TikTok trend or something, where you looked up the definition of your name and like you shared it on a on a TikTok, and this was I don't know. This was like a couple of years ago, I think like two or three years ago, that I went to do it and I was like, oh, oh, let me look up the definition of my name. My, the definition of my name is actually joy. I love that. Yes, like I looked it up and I was like this can't be real. I hadn't looked at the definition of my name for like years. When I was a little girl, we used to get those little name cards with like your definition at like their local amusement park.

Speaker 3:

I, I don't know, you're a millennial, you might not remember that oh, no, no, no, I just have a unique name that never was on a was never on it.

Leslie:

Okay, I got her well at least the spelling, though right, because kelly is a popular name, but your spelling is just different.

Speaker 3:

You wouldn't your name, but it was never. I've never in my life seen a keychain with even the IE or the I oh, how funny so but I know exactly what you're talking about, because I yeah.

Leslie:

So there were these like those so there were these like like little definition cards. It would have like your name and it would be like in a rainbow print like little laminated thing and it would have like the definitions of your name and stuff. But again this is like junior high kind of status, never looked at the definitions of your name and stuff. But again, this is like junior high kind of status, never looked at the definition of my name like I think since then. And then this TikTok trend comes on and I look at the definition on Google and I'm like what Are you kidding me?

Speaker 3:

Because you know names in the Bible. They had deep meaning, and when Jesus would rename, or God would rename somebody in the Bible too, that had a deep meaning too, and so I love that you're, you're. You are living out the call on your life of joy. Yes, and that is. That is so cool, and I, I love my name for its uniqueness, and I actually my mom, named me after a character on this eighties television show, and I started watching the show recently and I was blown away. What show was it Dallas oh okay.

Speaker 3:

So I'm named after one of the characters on Dallas and my mom said, well, I kind of had a feeling that you would be artistic and, you know, maybe an artist of some sort, and I thought you were going to be blonde and all these different things. And as I watched the character, I have felt so loved by my mom because she's so cool and I'm like, wow, this is crazy, that that's where my name came from and how prophetic it really was on my mom's end of somehow knowing like she's gonna come out to be very artsy and just kind of unique and this petite little thing and the blonde's not natural. But you know, that's okay, everything else is.

Leslie:

That's funny. You know, what's funny is that my mom named me from a TV show also, but it was General Hospital. Oh, there was a character on General Hospital. Look at us, the soap opera babies. Yeah right, so funny. I was the daytime soap opera, you were the nighttime soap opera, but I love it, but it's funny.

Speaker 3:

Another friend connection I love it. Yes, it's so funny okay anyways, we're closing up.

Leslie:

We can probably sit and chat for hours, but um, lastly, kelly, just tell the audience where they can find you and connect with you.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, uh, callielogancom. That's kind of the why. Or I'm on Instagram, on Facebook, on all those things. I'm not on TikTok, but maybe eventually, but I love connecting with people and just hearing stories and everything else. So thank you so much for today. Today's been a lot of fun.

Leslie:

I loved it. Kelly and for all the listeners, check out the show notes because all of her links will be in there for her books, her website and her Instagram handle will be in there, and Kelly and I became friends on Instagram. I love her IG too. She's so resourceful and has like amazing stuff on there. But just such a beautiful conversation today, kelly.

Speaker 3:

Thank you again.

Leslie:

You know, friendships that are rooted in Christ just truly have the power to transform our lives and our faith, and I just hope that this episode was encouraging to help you. Whoever is listening right now I'm speaking to you, amen. I hope that this episode just encouraged you just to cultivate deeper, more intentional friendships that just reflect the love of God. So if you enjoyed this conversation, make sure that you share it with someone you love. And until next time, friend, keep chasing joy.