Your Joyful Order With Leslie Martinez

#115- Conflict Resolution in Leadership with Lauren Bronson Petrous

• Leslie Martinez • Season 5 • Episode 114

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What if conflict isn't something to avoid, but rather an essential pathway to growth? Leadership coach Lauren Bronson-Petros reveals how our relationship with tension shapes our effectiveness as leaders, and why most people struggle to approach difficult conversations despite knowing their importance.

Drawing from her background in organizational change and conflict resolution, Lauren introduces the powerful BRAVE framework—a five-step approach that transforms how we navigate challenging interactions. She unpacks why understanding your conflict history matters, how to determine whether something is worth addressing, and the critical difference between seeking resolution versus simply wanting to be right.

The conversation takes a fascinating turn as Lauren distinguishes between comfort and peace, explaining why the pursuit of comfort keeps us stagnant while peace allows us to act with courage even when facing discomfort. "We often talk about authenticity as a highlight reel," she notes, "but if you're being authentic, it also means acknowledging the parts of you that need growth."

For anyone who's ever avoided a difficult conversation or wondered how to approach conflict more effectively, this discussion provides practical wisdom and a transformative perspective. Lauren offers specific strategies for staying grounded during tense moments, understanding what's truly at stake, and measuring success beyond merely winning arguments.

Ready to develop what Lauren calls an "immunity to discomfort"? This episode will equip you with the mindset and tools to transform your leadership by embracing rather than avoiding the tensions that inevitably arise in any meaningful work. Subscribe now and learn how the healthiest teams aren't conflict-free—they're conflict fluent.

Connect with Lauren: 

Website: https://boundlessandco.com/
IG: https://www.instagram.com/laurenbronsonpetrous/

Connect with Leslie:

Follow on IG: @yourjoyfulorderstyle

Website: https://www.yourjoyfulorder.com/

Email: lmartinez@yourjoyfulorder.com
to schedule- Speaking Events, Interviews or Life Coaching Sessions

Shop my SOAP the Gospels Journal on Shopify:
https://shopjoyfulorder.com/

Watch this Episode on You Tube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsXoAYIM2mfclNtYiaOzIUw

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https://a.co/d/09Djvaw

Book a FREE 30 Minute Discovery Coaching Call: https://tidycal.com/joyfulordermedia/30-minute-meeting

Speaker 1:

Hey friend, today we're talking about something most people avoid, and that's conflict. We'll explore conflict resolution in leadership and how leaders can turn tensions into opportunities for transformation. Whether you're navigating challenges in your team or striving to become a more effective leader, today's conversation is packed with insights to help you lead with authenticity, courage and confidence. Today's guest is Lauren Bronson-Petros. She is the CEO and founder of Boundless Co. She's a leadership coach and consultant who helps mission-driven leaders navigate conflict, build strong organizational cultures and lead with boldness and authenticity. With a master's in organizational change from Northwestern and certifications in high-performance leadership and conflict resolution from Cornell, lauren brings both expertise and heart to the work of transformational leadership. She's passionate about helping leaders turn tension into growth and step fully into their purpose. She has so much insight to offer and I know that this episode is going to challenge and encourage you, so let's get ready to jump into this week's episode.

Speaker 1:

Hey everyone, I'm Leslie Martinez and you're listening to your Joyful Order podcast. Each week, I will bring you joyful stories that will motivate and inspire you and, at the same time, bring order to your everyday life. Let's just say the show will be a mixture of preaching and teaching, with a kick of motivation from your girl here. Welcome to your Joyful Order podcast and we're back. I am so thrilled to welcome Lauren Bronson Petros to the show. Lauren, thank you so much for being here today. Leslie, thank you, it's such a pleasure. Oh, I'm so glad that we worked everything out For you guys.

Speaker 1:

Not or watching, you might be wondering where is Leslie? Totally different background. We had a pivot today. Zoom was having a day, so thank you, Lauren, for pivoting, and you guys are going to see a very different looking show today. But it's all good because the quality and the content is what matters, not withdrawing. Leaders know how to pivot. Strong leaders know how to change. So we're just acting out. What we're saying is important, exactly, exactly.

Speaker 1:

So today we're talking about conflict, lauren, and it's something that most people avoid. It is something I know I myself have avoided many times. So I just you have a strong background in conflict resolution and leadership and I just I want to know how that all started. How did you first discover the importance of conflict resolution in your own journey? Yeah, totally. Well, I have to say I didn't even know someone specializing as a conflict strategist or a consultant that helps in conflict resolution was even a thing right. So I would say I grew up in a household where we were really my mom really drove into us living in a line with our values. So what we say is important to us.

Speaker 1:

But it kind of was a little bit of a culture where it was turn the other cheek. So I grew up allowing a lot of conflict or not knowing how to stick up for myself or not knowing how to vocalize needs or trying to kind of check someone when they need to. And then I went the other opposite and I was like this is ridiculous, I need to stand up for myself. And I became this extreme, so I kind of call it with my clients the turtle or the porcupine. So a turtle goes into their shell, they like hide, they diminish themselves, they avoid at all costs sticking up for themselves or bringing up an issue or addressing conflict of any kind. And then there's the porcupine. So you like get way bigger than themselves to make to protect themselves. They get more antagonistic. And so I've learned both ends of the spectrum and at the end of the day I was like communication and conflict are necessities in life. There's no way we're going to avoid them as human beings.

Speaker 1:

Conflict is everywhere. So I literally had this this moment. I was working with a large Fortune 500 company. There was so much tension in the room I was called in to consult with them to help them, as a leadership team, align towards their goals. But there was so much conflict in the room I sat here and thought if people aren't willing to deal with the elephants in the room, I don't care how great of an eloquent, beautiful culture strategy five-year goal we have, we're not dealing with the real root issues. And so I started getting certified in conflict resolution.

Speaker 1:

I went and got my master's at Northwestern in organizational change, and so that began my journey of really trying to understand, study deeply what is the science behind conflict Like, what are frameworks and tools and strategies we as human beings can do to become more efficient at conflict and what are the real reasons of why we avoid it and how can we grow a greater immunity to the discomfort that conflict brings. So that's kind of brought me on my whole journey. That really started as a young girl all the way up to today, and I just could not be more passionate about it, because whether you're an executive working for a Fortune 500, or you're a stay-at-home mom with two kids or you're just trying to figure out conflict with your friends. We all experience it. We've all been victims of really difficult conversations. We've all had moments where conflict kind of went well and we are curious about it and it's just something that is not. It's not avoidable. And so why be afraid of something that is not going to be avoidable? Yes, and so many people just like run from it. Right, they want to sweep it under the rug.

Speaker 1:

So let's, let's unpack what you like have discovered in some of this. I can imagine some of it is why we avoid it. A lot of it is probably tied to emotional right and probably your background and stuff. So what are some common things that you have found as to why people will avoid the conflict Totally? So one of the things I do when clients will come to me with conflict is I end up kind of taking them first exactly to what you said, to their upbringing. Okay, what was conflict like in your household? Did people yell all the time or did people avoid it at all costs? Did you learn early on that if you spoke your mind that you were chastised for that, or did you learn that it was a good thing? So so much of our development in our upbringing curates not only our perception of conflict but how we choose to enter it or not. So understanding where you come from is a huge component and that's usually where I take my clients to in the beginning is first getting self-awareness around, how you are woven together, what makes you you and what makes you and conflict.

Speaker 1:

What is a relationship like with conflict? From there, you know the thing that you mentioned about avoidance. People say they want conflict resolution, but what they really want is a guarantee. So people don't enter into conflict because we don't know the outcome. Right, like, conflict is scary. So like I am not the consultant or the person or the leader that's going to say just be fearless, like, get over it, just say what you need to say. I'm like no, anything that's risky is fear inducing. It's scary to put your heart out there. It's scary to be vulnerable. It's scary to risk a relationship, an employee leaving, miscommunication between someone you love. It's very scary. And so I think we first have to own what is your fear and what are you afraid of risking, and I think that's really important.

Speaker 1:

It's often a misstep when, in my field, we'll go straight to the problem solving. But you need to understand that people are risking something and that needs to be validated. But then you have to factor in the flip side. Is you know, first validating it and then the flip side is is challenging them. What is the cost you're willing to pay? Because settling and avoiding is also costing you something, just as entering into conflict can also cost you something. So what are you willing to pay? What is the price you're willing to pay for an outcome that in no way, shape or form, is guaranteed?

Speaker 1:

Even when I walk alongside someone and you know they've done everything to the best of their ability, sometimes you can't control the person across from you. Sometimes you could do the best you could and the outcome is still not what you wanted, and that's scary, but you can say that you lived in alignment to what you said was important to you. So I just I developed this five-part framework. It's called Brave and it's five steps that help my clients work through in real time If they have a hard conversation that they're about to encounter. It's kind of a process. Can I go into it with you? Yes, please. Yes, I'm writing all these down, by the way. Yes, you're amazing. Look, she's an A-plus student. Everyone she's writing.

Speaker 1:

So the first step when you feel like whether you're a leader needing to adjust something or address something with a teammate or a client, or even just a friend to a friend, the first thing you need to do is okay, conflict is occurring and I need to understand first, what do I believe in? What is my why? So the B part of the framework is believe in something bigger than yourself. That is step one. The reason I ask clients to think this through. This goes back to that idea of what price are you willing to pay If you enter into this conversation? Why are you doing it? Why? What's your hoped outcome?

Speaker 1:

For example, if it's a friend to a friend, you could be like I have been distancing myself from this person, but I miss them and I want to fight for this relationship. So this relationship is important to me and I feel like I'm living out of alignment by being fake with this person. I need it to stop, so that's why I want to enter into this. That's one example. Another example could be I'm a leader that tells my team how important having a healthy culture is, but I'm allowing a high performing employee to have a bad attitude and to be an actually like toxic person in our culture. But because they're performing well, I'm avoiding having conflict with them or addressing this issue with them because I'm scared they're going to leave.

Speaker 1:

So what you're, what you have to do with, the believe in something bigger than yourself is OK. So does practicing what you preach, which is having a healthy culture? Does that matter more to you? Or does actually, at the end of the day, where you have to get honest with yourself, does their performance and the value they bring, like financially or monetarily, is that more important to you? So you have to figure out what are you believing in and what's your why. Does that make sense for the beast? Yes, good.

Speaker 1:

So staying in the right mindset before entering into a conversation, because this, what your why is, is going to determine your north in this conversation it's what you have to keep focused on, because many of us again are seeking, we say, conflict resolution, but a lot of us just want to win. A lot of us enter a conversation being like here's my data, here's my points for why I'm bright, and if you don't see my opinion, then this is all a fail, or, like you know, then we're not resolved. But I always challenge people. I'm like then you're not really looking for resolution, you're just looking to be right, and so until you can enter into the right heart posture and the right mindset of believing in something bigger than yourself, which means resolution, it doesn't mean you're winning. No matter how right or wrong or fair you feel like the situation is, you're not healthy enough to get into this conversation. So that's step one. That happens before you enter it.

Speaker 1:

Step two is R reframe the moment. So this is again getting you set up and prepared for this conversation. You have to practice, you have to get into a space of pre-work before entering into this conversation, because it's again, it's scary, it's uncertain and you're risking a lot. So r is reframe the moment and this is where you're going to take yourself and zoom out. Okay, so 10 minutes from now, after I have this conversation, how do I feel? What am I? What are the outcomes, pro or con? And then, 10 months from now, what is? What does my life look like because I had this conversation or because I didn't? And you weigh the pros and the cons 10 years from now, it's called the 10-10-10 method. 10 years from now, what does my life look like, having had this conversation or not.

Speaker 1:

So to go back to the friendship analogy I started with, if you're a friend and you feel resentful about this friend and you've been having distance towards them, you think this through. You're like okay, I'm fighting for this relationship. That's what's important to me in being authentic. B is done Now, r. If I don't, if I do have this conversation and 10 minutes after this conversation it went poorly, what is my life going to be like? How am I going to feel If, 10 minutes after this conversation, it goes wow, what does that look like 10 months from now? What does that relationship look like 10 years from now? What is that relationship? Like you guys could be stronger than ever and you can go only deeper and richer into relationship, because you're not only staying in an artificial superficial relationship but going deeper, and that always enhances our relationships, or you may not be friends anymore. Like. These are the factors that you have to think in. So that's B is believe in something bigger than yourself. R is reframe the moment.

Speaker 1:

Now we're at A, which is assess with curiosity. So now you're entering into, you're now officially in conversation with someone, and the reason I picked assess is because so often we're too quick to assume. Leslie, do you ever feel like we all can be like, oh, that must be that that this person did X, y, z. As humans, we're so quick to judge, we're so quick to assume. But what that does is it leaves no room for curiosity, and curiosity invitation to hear the other person's perspective, person's perspective, and what you do when you first start a conversation by first asking questions and seeking to understand the other person's perspective is you want eliminate defensiveness was just huge. Two, you're showing integrity and a genuine desire to understand, not just be right. And three, through asking questions, it gives you the opportunity to assess what is actually going on, because sometimes, for example, again, we're going to keep these we can use the the friend example.

Speaker 1:

If my friend isn't pursuing me as much as she used to and so I feel like she doesn't care about me anymore, um, if I assume that and then base all my anger and resentment in this conversation, after you don't love me anymore. But if I ask questions and try and figure out what is she going through in her life? How does she feel towards me? Does she feel like I've been different? And I ask and assess what her answers are, the root issue may not be that she doesn't love you anymore. It may be that she feels like she's a burden and so, in her shame and embarrassment, she's been removing herself, like you know, know, you don't know. This is just an example. This happens all the times, even with leaders and teammates. They, a leader, will assume someone on their team is acting, you know, underperforming, and then they make this narrative in their head about them.

Speaker 1:

But if you take the a in the, you know, number three in the framework, you can take the time to properly assess with curiosity what's going on. Now something I this is one of the hardest parts, especially when you feel like you've been really wrong, really really hard, leslie, as you know, to be like I'm going to be trying here, I'm going to try and be curious and hear about your viewpoints, and sometimes you're like brewing, you're like that's so not true. You know that's a, it's so hard, but, but that's the part of the equation that's going to cost you the most, but the part of the conversation where you're going to show whether you really are interested in resolution or again being right. And so assessing with curiosity. Now notice, I didn't say acknowledge or affirm, I didn't say affirm where you have to agree with what they're saying, but when you show curiosity, it gives them the dignity and gives you the integrity to properly assess. Does that make sense? So good, yes, no, absolutely Okay. Keep going, girl. I want to know what D and the E Keep going Great. The V Okay.

Speaker 1:

So the V is be very clear on what your needs are. So you have to, after you've been curious and listen to them. You have to then be very clear on, like, what do you need from them, what are your thoughts and what are your feelings? Without this, this is sometimes people. This is also what this pre-work is very important, because when you get to the V, sometimes people are just so full of emotion they can't even articulate what you really need from this person. So if you're the leader moving forward like you make me feel disrespected or you bring down the culture of the team when you bring this attitude into play. So this is not going to happen anymore and this is what I need. So you have to be very, very clear.

Speaker 1:

And then the last one, bouncing off of the V, is to end with clarity. So there always needs to be next steps of how we're going to measure what we just agreed upon. So, even if it's in a friendship, if one friend says, hey, I feel really loved when you call me, then the agreement could be like OK, I don't like calling or talking on the phone, but one way to make you feel loved is I promise, like once every two weeks, I'm gonna at least call you, like a very clear measurable, so that both parties can come back to you and be very clear on what was my agreement to you and what was your agreement to me, in order to move this forward. And that's a huge, huge component, leslie, that I see all the time that people just don't put measurables in place. So then it leaves room again for emotions and confusion to take over miscommunications and misunderstanding. So, in a nutshell, that's the five-part framework that anyone again, whether an individual working with a friend or a leader at work that I bring them through. This is absolutely amazing, absolutely amazing. It's cool.

Speaker 1:

Okay, I completed a 10-week course at church Emotionally Healthy Relationships and we love it Through Pete Scazzaro's framework. He's amazing and like this aligns with everything in that course that I just did. So it really is learning to process like our emotions right and have healthy relationships. Process like our emotions right and have healthy relationships, but the key component of that is learning to properly communicate. I think also and this, like this framework right here, also just aligns with, I mean, not just as a leader, friendships, marriage, as a parent right that you can apply this to any relationship and one of the challenges that I have found I like to say that I over communicate with people, like I love to communicate with people.

Speaker 1:

I'm very detailed oriented type A personality. You ask for details. I, I'm gonna give you like a whole 12 page. Yes, okay, so, so that essentially is me. However, when it comes to communicating my emotions, I'm not good at that. That's where I bottle things up and I just keep it inside and I'm like I'm just not gonna say anything and then I let it get to a point where it's I express it in a non-healthy way, you know, and unfortunately, like my husband is typically like he gets the wrath of it when I've just like I'm done, I I'm no longer, um, I have definitely learned. I mean, we've survived almost 24 years of marriage, so we've, we're doing something, congratulations, thank you. Yes, clearly, we're doing some things right, you know, in that. So I don't, I want to give us a little bit of credit in that, but I do know that we are constantly evolving and we have learned to use those communication skills.

Speaker 1:

Now, when it comes into leadership, like there's so many different rules than Jesus and this conversation it isn't just for people in the workplace, like this is even for the stay at home mom, I mean her framework, that great you can apply it to, like she said, you know, your marriage, friendship or anything. But in this I want to know OK, communication but also authenticity. In this I want to know, okay, communication but also authenticity. Like I'm not being authentic if I'm bottling up my emotions and how can leaders stay true to themselves while going through that framework? Also, totally, it's.

Speaker 1:

It's a great question and something I always say is you know, unspoken conflict never disappears. It just goes underground and grows roots. So when unspoken conflict is happening, you think that nothing is taking place because you're like artificially keeping a peace or an artificial harmony. But what I literally have my clients do is imagine that your unspoken conflict is just going underground and these roots and weeds are growing. So the thing that is the mindset shift is that we often have to recognize that the healthiest teens are the healthiest friendships, the healthiest couples. They're not conflict free, they're just conflict fluent.

Speaker 1:

And how you become conflict fluent is again going through the framework that I shared Believe in something bigger than yourself, reframing the moment, making sure that you're healthy enough to have this conversation, and then you assess the situation. You're leading with curiosity, you're voicing your needs clearly and you're ending with clarity. If you can do that, then along the way you're having to kind of get in, look at yourself in the mirror and to your point about authenticity, and be like it's really the root here, because if I came in hot to trot like I'm so right, you hurt me. And then if you do the A part where you're like, okay, but I'm going to assess I mean, because a lot of times my clients are like, okay, well, I'll do it for them, but we know that I'm right I'm like, okay, okay, buddy. And then they go in and they start to all their blind spots get revealed Not always, not always.

Speaker 1:

Sometimes there are certainly clear but a lot of times, leslie, someone else's perspective you're like what, how could you think that? And then you're having to be confronted with yourself, which, if here's the thing about authenticity we often talk about it as such a highlight reel. This is who I am, this is who I want to be, and yes and amen. And if you're being authentic, it also means there's ugly, parts of you Like there just is. All of us have that. We all have this light in the shadow, we all have this sin and this glory. We all have these beautiful strengths and we also have these weaknesses and areas for growth. And so what conflict does is it forces you, if you're doing it again in the healthiest way possible, to see the strength and the beauty and the sacrifice and the love that you've given Absolutely the strength and the beauty and the sacrifice and the love that you've given Absolutely. But it also shows ooh, I might be actually missing the mark here, or, wait, I was assuming I was in the right, and yes, I kind of am, but they are too. And so how I frame authenticity when it comes to conflict resolution or when it even comes to leading teams, is this word alignment? So I feel like back to this B? This believe teams. Is this word alignment, so I feel like back to this B? This believe in something bigger than yourself?

Speaker 1:

Something I often do with clients is I have them go through a very similar process that I lead organizations and large companies through, which is choosing your core values. Now, some of us are like, ok, values are like fluffy words, and I'm like, if you think that about core values, that's because people aren't living them out, which shows a misalignment between what they say is important to them and how they're actually living. So what I do is this core values. If you could pick five to seven values, leslie, that are so unique to who you are, that are how you make your decisions, it's what you believe in and, for example, like I have my seven values, I have them written on my desk. So when I'm with a client, or if I have a difficult meeting, or if I'm brainstorming and thinking something creative, or as a CEO for a consulting firm, I'm having to make hard decisions all the time I literally keep my values in place because that is my compass, that is, believing in something bigger than myself. And so when I'm living in alignment with those values meaning these are words I say are important to me and I'm living in alignment through my actions not perfectly, but consistently that is me being authentic to who I say I am, but it's alignment, because authenticity, again, we like to talk culturally, that authenticity is about like this is who my personality is and they need to get over it, or like this is who I am. If you have a problem with that, then I'm not for you and I'm kind of like, yes again, but if you're also being authentic, you also have some things that you need to work on and you, if you're being authentic, you, you, you're not perfect, my friend, so it's about doing that hard work about how are you actually living. It's about doing that hard work about how are you actually living and when you take a hard look, do your actions really align with what you say isn't important to you? And it's hard work, but it's beautiful work and I believe it's sacred work. It's really getting in alignment emotionally, spiritually, mentally, with how you live your life and how you lead. Yes, yes, gosh, lauren, so good. I mean being your true, authentic self. Definitely, I think me going through this course.

Speaker 1:

There's been some other like deep dive work that I've done. There was kind of like a three day intensive that I did a while back, and this was all focused on internal work and really looking at the areas of where am I lacking, what am I struggling with. What are the challenges that I have? And when you do that deep dive work, it's not fun, it is, it's not it's ugly, it's hard. You're up to who you are authentically and then you start to uncover stuff and kind of have like a revelation of like, oh wow, I, I do do that, like I am prideful, which is a sin, you know, I I do always feel that I have to be right. I do have trust issues, I do have the need to always perform and show up perfect, um, totally, and those are all just like some of just the tip of the iceberg of the things that I uncovered. But doing, yeah, doing the work, it's real and it.

Speaker 1:

But I also want to cut you out, but I also hope you see, the beautiful, like part of the mirror is, like one of the emotional parts is actually women specifically, are much easier at recognizing their weaknesses quicker than men typically. But the women, when I ask, and what is beautiful that you see, I'm telling you, 50% of the women, when I'm coaching and walking through this, start to cry yeah, because both are true, you know, and depending on where you're at, it's just interesting. So I hope, as you were listing those very breaking things that you were saying about yourself which is powerful and freeing for you to be like, oh shoot, maybe these are things I do have and I know so many of us, myself included, share those with you. But to then be able to look at them as well and be like and this is but even so, like okay, for instance. So no, I very much did that.

Speaker 1:

Each of those flaws also aligns with, like, my good quality. So having that like perfectionist, I'm really detailed oriented, right, so like they, they kind of go hand in hand, and being prideful means like I just have really high standards for certain things too. So there's things that align like, yes, they, you know, not the best. I just have to kind of flip and realize like okay, I have to use that for the good of it, which has been a work in process, however, yeah, however, doing the work, it's not always fun.

Speaker 1:

You uncover some things that you realize and it does stem back to, like your childhood and your upbringing, which I tied all of that together and I realized you know some of the challenges of not processing my emotions at all that I grew up in an abusive home and like if I spoke wrong. I feared, you know, my father getting upset, hitting me, you know all of this stuff. So we didn't process emotions, we just like bottled it up. And then I also didn't have control. So, growing up like I'm, I'm a control freak. Why am I a control freak? Because I had no control as a child. So I try to control situations and I try to avoid conflict at all costs, because I grew up in conflict and it wasn't fun.

Speaker 1:

So, processing all of that it's definitely doing the work, but it is like you said, it's good work and it's something that people need to do. So what advice? Very powerful, yeah, it is. And this isn't just for leaders. I mean, this is, this is advice for everybody that you know is just really trying to be a better human, learn to engage their teams, even maybe in their homes, but they really want to just maintain their composure. How do you typically guide them?

Speaker 1:

Okay, you did the brave framework, which is absolutely amazing. I guess let me reframe this a little bit, because you gave us the framework right there but we have people that even just taking that first step of yeah, and it's perfect that you name it brave, because you have to be brave, you're the first, totally Right. Hey, you need to approach this conflict so that you can like kind of gain that confidence to know that they can continue to do it in a healthy way. Does that make sense? Yes, yeah, no, absolutely. So I think a lot of this to your point exactly, and thank you for sharing all that. It's so beautiful and it's so profound. When you see this journey of like, see, it's tied to my childhood and I react in this way. So doing that internal work brings self-awareness, and self-awareness is one of those powerful skillsets you can have.

Speaker 1:

So someone who's already doing the work of gaining self-awareness is already showing that, hey, I'm willing to step into discomfort in order to receive clarity. Because here's the thing, clarity costs something, but confusion costs something as well. It goes back to this idea of what price are you willing to pay? And so when I confront clients with that question, what price are you willing to pay? So if you want to avoid this, no problem, continue doing so. What's the cost you're paying by doing that? If you want to address this issue, what's the cost you're willing to pay for the clarity, or for the reestablished relationship, or for living in alignment with what you say is important to you, what's that cost? And so when you live and I make them, I write down what is the cost you're willing to pay. What is the price you're willing to pay, and when you can kind of see them laid out, the always the scariest one is obviously the one that's going to require the most discomfort, which is usually entering into some form of conflict, and so weighing the cost is really important. And then when you've decided, okay, no, I do, I do want to live differently, then we need to work through this, this, I, this default we all have towards comfort.

Speaker 1:

Comfort is ingrained in our society. You know, a lot of people say like you know whatever's most comfortable to you, just live your life in comfort, and a lot of there's a lot of wellness coaches and a lot of people out there that are saying that, and I'm not saying that's wrong, but I would challenge the terminology a little bit. I would say that we need to move towards inner peace. Peace is different than comfort. I can do something really hard and have peace about it. I can be shaking, I could be nervous, I could go like I want to go. I have to go pee seven times before I have this conversation, but I have internal peace because it's in alignment with what I say is important to me, and I'm going to do this, even though it's going to cost me, even though it's uncertain, even though it's risky. I have peace about what I'm doing and so I'm going to enter into this.

Speaker 1:

That's very different than someone who lives their life by comfort, because comfort will always keep you stagnant. Comfort keeps you at a level that's comfortable, and in order to rise in your leadership, in order to tap into your full potential, in order to live an abundant life that Jesus died for us to have, you have to be uncomfortable. You have to, and so, to me, that's why I go back to this. I'm not the kind of person my husband probably wishes I was, but I'm not the kind of person that's like. You know, just do it and everything will be fine. Be fearless, like again. I'm like. No, acknowledge the fear. What you're doing is scary and, exactly like you said, I specifically named the break framework.

Speaker 1:

It's it's the number one word is brave Doing something? Afraid because you believe in something? So much is what courage is, and so I just really take a lot of time with my clients to help them understand Are you really wanting change or do you really want comfort? Are you willing to pay the price for clarity or do you want to pay the price for confusion and misunderstanding? Everything costs something. The question is, what are you willing to pay, and when? You can answer that question and live your life in alignment to the price you're willing to pay.

Speaker 1:

You grow in power, you grow in strength, you grow in clarity. Your knees can be shaking, you can have tears down your face, but at the end of the day you can look at yourself in the mirror and say I lived in alignment with what I said was important to me and even if I lost the friend or lost the employee, I believe in what I did and I did my very best to do it healthily and with wisdom. And at the rest of the end, at the end of the day, we are in charge of our choices. We are not in charge of our outcomes. Yes, and you just like drop the mic right there. It's like, do I want the change or do I just want to remain comfortable?

Speaker 1:

And Jesus didn't call us to stay comfortable. He's pushing us to step out in faith, to do the scary things and trust him in the process of it and having healthy relationships, learning to create, you know just I don't want to say create conflict learning to approach conflict in a healthy way, um, that is really part of just our calling as being disciples, you know, learning to love and embrace people. Loving people is hard, lauren, like I know that there's really it honestly it sucks, and like it really. The thing that I love too about what you brought up about Jesus is that, like he we always hear this you know these terminology truth, truth and grace, which Jesus did so perfectly. But I think that's something that we should strive for Because, again, it's this tension of, like you, yes, there's times where you need to let this battle go or let this thing happen, but then there's times where it's like and now enough, this needs to be addressed.

Speaker 1:

And Jesus did not play, he confronted the challenge and he didn't live his life. The success of his being and living and leading wasn't did I make everyone comfortable. He called everyone to live uncomfortably. He called us to actually rise up and live into discomfort. But he also said pursue peace at all costs. So that I think also said pursue peace at all costs, yeah, so that I think this alignment of pursue peace at all costs, which is alignment, which is being rooted in something bigger than yourself, which is following of what you say is important to you, which is living in lines of values and, at the same time, growing in an immunity.

Speaker 1:

That's what I always say, cause, like I said, I hate when people say be fearless. I'm like it just feels so, like I've already failed, like, oh, I can't be fearless, so why? So? That's why I don't like it. But again, cheers to those people that do it. But for me, I don't like that. But what I say is if we can grow an immunity towards being uncomfortable. So you know, like babies get sick all the time. Our kids are always sick because they're still building an immune system that can fight off the colds, that can fight off flu, that can fight off thuds. But as they grow and they become more and more immune and they're strong, their immune system grows stronger and stronger. It's not that they'll never get sick, but it doesn't affect them like it used to. So, as I said in the beginning, you're gonna have so much fear and you're going to feel like this is the end of the world if I have this conversation because you're growing an immune system to be able to handle the discomfort that conflict bears. But if you can stay in it and just like a muscle, keep growing, keep working out, keep putting yourself in those situations, grow your immune system.

Speaker 1:

I have conflict all the time. I'm literally paid money to come in and help with people with conflict. That's my job. Money to come in and help with people with conflict like that's my job. So, but but in so doing, even when it's not a conflict between me and another party but I'm facilitating or mediating something, it I always carry the weight of the room like it's I have a serious role I need or it's. Even though I'm technically the expert coming in, I still view conflict with wariness, as you should, and there's high risk and high outcomes that can, that can occur. But I'm able to be comfortable in conflict. I'm able to be comfortable, uncomfortable. I'm able to have peace and conflict. And so that's where I just love what you brought up with, like the Lord, and how we can weave in this like peace versus comfort mentality, because I do think that it's something we we can forget. Yes, you know, I'll kind of wrap this up here and close on this.

Speaker 1:

One of my favorite stories from the Bible is when Jesus heals the paralyzed man that had been sitting in the healing waters for like umpteenth years. Right, and he heals him and he, like he asked him do you want to be healed? And he gives all these excuses as to why, you know oh, they passed me by, they wouldn't carry me in Like he's giving all these excuses because he's in his comfort. And then Jesus heals him and tells him now pick up your mat and walk. And that was Jesus's way of like, making him uncomfortable. You've been comfortable on that mat all of these years, not even attempting to try to get yourself into the healing waters. And then Jesus is like, look, I'm going to do you a solid, I'm going to heal you. Heal you, you need to pick up your mat and go. So get out of your comfort zone and go. And that's just one of my.

Speaker 1:

That story just speaks to me in so boldly, in so many different ways. But that's an example, yeah, a perfect example. It's like we need to get out of our comfort zone to do what Jesus called us. And what did he do? He told them pick up your mat and go. And he went and told others like, hey, jesus healed me. He, he's the Messiah, he's the chosen one. Like so he went and spread the word about Jesus and how he healed him, which is what we're all supposed to do. But we just need to get up off of our mats, we need to get up off the couch, get up off of behind our phones or whatever. Stop being comfortable to go and do what God called us to do. And is there going to be conflict? You're darn right, there's going to be conflict, but that's like that's part of being a disciple, part of doing what God called us to do, and that's just a part of human nature, like it's not avoidable, like you said.

Speaker 1:

You know so, lauren, I know we got to wrap up here. Oh, my goodness, I, I'm going to bring you back next season. Just let's just. I mean, it's such a pleasure. Yes, but I love it. I want to close first. If you can share with our audience all they can connect with you, if there's any resources that they can find with you, go ahead and just let them know.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, well, I would love to hear from any of your, your listeners, your viewers. You can find me at wwwboundlessandcocom. That's my company, boundless and Co. I'm on Instagram. We just it's a whole thing. I've just started getting on Instagram now. Leslie, you're, you're, you have a down pack. We're trying to learn from you. But it's Lauren Bronson, petras on Instagram and balance and co on Instagram as well. And yeah, I have 20 minute complimentary get to know you connects to make sure, if you're a leader of a company, I would love to talk to you. If you're just looking to grow as a leader, as an individual, we'd love to chat with you. We only have those 20-minute free connects, so we'd love to hear from you. And, okay, I just have to throw a shout-out to your amazing husband, because I had him as a guest, like in the beginning of the season. So for my listeners, jarek Petros is Lauren's husband and he was, I think, like my second episode of this past season back in September and we talked all about apologetics and like I learned so much from Jarek's class and he's so smart. He is like absolutely amazing. You guys are definitely like the power couple that you guys are both doing amazing work. So I love and adore both of you guys.

Speaker 1:

And then just one last fun question, actually two what brings you joy? And then if there is a book that pertains to any of this topic that you would recommend to the listeners. Oh my gosh. Okay, I'm going to go with the book first. So Brene Brown is queen of a lot of the things that we're talking about. So Dare to Lead If you're a leader, even if you're just looking to grow and having more strength and having some of these conversations. Dare to Lead by Brene Brown is a phenomenal book. Authentic Gravitas is actually also another amazing book by Elizabeth Newton, and it really just focuses on helping you understand more of who you are. So I love that book. I also love anything, peter Scazzaro, as you mentioned, the emotional intelligence, so huge fan.

Speaker 1:

And then something that gives me joy. I have two answers, but you know immediately came to mind. One is traveling, um, seeing the world. It's something I've done since I was a young girl, and being exposed to different cultures, people's language, food, um, just gives me so much joy and wonder of the world that God created and his people. And the second thing that gives me a lot of joy is I love waking up early and having my morning ritual with the Lord, which is just me and him. In our library. I have my massive cup of coffee and I have to have it Honestly. It's my joy in the morning to start and ground my day, so I love it. I love it Well, lauren. Thank you so much for your time and your wisdom. And to the listeners if this episode was insightful for you, if it brought you encouragement, can you please go and share it with a loved one and bring that same encouragement and insightfulness to them? And until next time, friends, keep chasing joy.